Victory for YES campaign

by Ray Mon Oct 21, 2002 15:22

It was in all the papers.
Do you have any analysis you want to add here, or is that it?

by bored Mon Oct 21, 2002 16:01

are we running the death penalty amendment again?

by Oul' Brit Mon Oct 21, 2002 17:08

I'm waiting for our re-entry into the Commonwealth and re-instatement of the monarchy. Sure aren't all those rebel idealist types bad for business and all?

by john - Irish Socialist Network Mon Oct 21, 2002 18:56

IMO the following were the major reasons for the swing to the Yes side (in no particular order).

A stronger effort made by all the bourgeoisie parties to canvass/campaign

A five to one ratio on campaign expenditure (advertising, etc.) by the Yes side.

Irish Business (for the first time) openly invested heavily in a yes vote

The TU leadership campaigned for a yes vote

The, so called, referendum commission rather than outlining both sides of the argument interpreted the "essence" of both arguments and their broadcasts were effectively, pro YES.

The No side devided into progressives against Nice and the National platform/No to Nice (Justin Barrett)/Immigration Platform.

National Newspapers all sided with the Yes vote and rigged the media coverage so there was a 3 to 1 ratio (at least) for the yes side.

Justin Barrett was (rightly)exposed as having links with extreme Nazi groups in Germany

I'm sure the other list members will have other points of view but, for me, the campaign exposes the need for greater collaboration on the
left/progressive front. We are too small to constantly bicker whilst the bourgeoisie have no difficulty uniting when it suits.

We need to develop informal linkages and campaigns on common ground amongst left/Green/anarchist/progressive forces to challenge capitalism.

Dare to struggle, dare to win!!!

John

by King Mob Mon Oct 21, 2002 19:40

This is a time of joy for those of us who have fought you nationalists and your fake leftie hangers on. You and your littel Ireland movement has been beaten. Your program against Nice was a reactionary one,especially the Anarchists. Hah! National Libertarians. NA NA NA NA!!!! NA NA NA NA!!!!

by iosaf mac diarmada (slight return) Mon Oct 21, 2002 21:22 iosaf at email dot com barcelona

these are now further protected by bad laws.
However with the accession of Poland, Estonia, Czech republic and Lithuania in 2004 we look forward to welcoming thousands of fellow anarchists and occupationists (squatters) into fortress Europe. These our comrades can no longer be refused entry to the EU s they´ll be living with us.
And the prostitutes will move east.
And much of the crime will move east.
And Kallingrad will remain an anomaly.
And calling for the removal of intellectual property and biotech is not a reactionary policy.
Spamming with NANANANANA is a reactionary policy.
And intellectual property on open newswires is subject to "copyleft" here there is no copyright the author keeps the moral right to be identified as the author but to apply "registered trademark" as Mr Heinzreport of Austria does smells.
Sorry but the "tomorrow´s news today" smells and spamming Indymedia with a "scoop" of how less than 50% of the Irish resident in Ireland voted Yes is spam.
and blasting bad german agitprop with your websites is spam at least give an option b4 hand.
And King Mob you are an asshole.
The combined forces of anarchists, LAN, SP, SWP, Greens and many other groups ensured that there was hithertoo unheard of co-operation and mutual pisstaking between opposition groups.
Very few people really expected a NO vote this time.
I congratulate the LEFT and the ECOLOGISTS and the PACIFISTS of Ireland.
I admire the ANARCHISTS.
Ye have all stated and refined your positions and are looking forward to the future.
That you persuaded 37% of the less than 50% that voted to vote NO is astounding on the budgets you worked with and against.
Ye have nothing to be ashamed of.
& losing faith in each other shall only serve the purposes of the RIGHT and "LABOUR"/"DL".
Beir Bua!
ye all have much to do as ye know well.
and I and my friends have no doubt that ye have the neccesary talents, genius and perseverance to do what needs to be done.
Fair Play to all of ye.

by hope at last Mon Oct 21, 2002 22:48

john from the Irish Socialist Network raises an excellent proposal for progressive groups to start co-operating on at least some issues. Nice showed to a limited extent how this can work and this needs to be build on by those groups that did work together during Nice.

by Barry Tue Oct 22, 2002 10:03

I would welcome John's (from ISN) suggestion that progressive groups should work together on issues where they have a common outlook, eg. the NIce Treaty.

However I think that it's very premature to be calling for a formal orgnanisation or party. The fact is that if the various left forces in Ireland today formed an alliance or new party it would be a sham. In England and Wales the Socialist Alliance is nothing more than a SWP front group with a few other sects.

by red and green too Tue Oct 22, 2002 20:56

I take Barry's point seriously and I have no doubt the SWP would do their best to dominate or failing that wreck any such iniative. However they did very little on Nice anyway so you would be better off without them, also people would take you more seriously without their loudhailers and silly sloganeering.