TCD silent protest a disgrace

by iosaf Tue Nov 12, 2002 15:08

and would you publish your reply to TCD SU email?

by Joe Sheehan Tue Nov 12, 2002 15:09

I am loathe to even call it a protest, 120 people standing there silently, he will feel like he is getting a welcome party.
Get out there TCD get loud, get noticed let him know that you do not welcome him to TCD or the governments fees.

by sgt derek bulldog bullroot Tue Nov 12, 2002 15:14

Ordinary people would rather see flying pickets, rather than po-faced miserable PSNI/GARDAI porker thugs anyday.

by Paul O'Donnell Tue Nov 12, 2002 15:50

Isn't it just like the Labour Party's campaign on Nice. "A different kind of Yes" - or in this case "A different kind of Protest" - give out about the establishment but don't rock the boat. Labour must wait. Students must wait. Will they hell....!

by Patrick Mc Hugh - Equality Officer ULSU Tue Nov 12, 2002 17:00 0207012 at student dot ul dot ie 086 1089256

If people want to be silent thats their choice. Militancy is an option but fundamentally nothing should be uniform. Look at ULSU's silent protest at the opening of Drumroe Student village in UL
5 days before 3500 Limerick students taking to the streets demanding no fees. Síle De Valera was handed 1600 signitures on a petition too. Get ALL the students involved!

http://www.csn.ul.ie/~photo/gallery/index.html

See other photos of the SU EGM which mandated the protest.

PS: THe student village is built on a Special Area of Conservation but thats another story.
The environment can wait - right Finighn?

by iosaf Tue Nov 12, 2002 20:53

though that would be a matter for the flying pickets to decide themselves no?

by Shane - SYTCD Tue Nov 12, 2002 22:37

This "protest" is a disgrace. The last protest that was held in trinity the SU got out over a thousand people against the fees, it was fairly loud and aggressive for the SU's standard.

What is the point in standing up silently, dressed in an SU t-shirt when noel dempsey arrives? Sure wouldn't it be a welcome break for the guy! Dempsey has to be met by anger and noise.

Its a pity CFE hasn't taken off as such within Trinity and the campaign has fallen to these guys. Again however this proves the need for a militent fighting students union not just in Trinity but also nationwide.

by Intransigent Wed Nov 13, 2002 01:18

While there is not as stong a Fianna Fail presence in the Trinity SU as the UCD SU a considerable presence still exists. These members are loathe to attack their own 'heroes.' The proposed protest is nothing more than a joke aimed at making students think that the SU is active in the fight against fees. It's probably the reason why the CFE didn't get kick started in Trinity. The SU is giving the students just about enough to please them but not nearly enough to actually fight the introduction of fees. The last protest was only organised to be in the front square in Trinity. The ensuing march only happened because students wanted to march down to the department of education. The SU had wanted to send 2 or 3 of it's senior members down to the department with the letters as a mere symbolic gesture. The SU is afraid to partake in any militancy or direct action whatsoever. It is up to individual students to convince their fellow students that this lathargic approach is not the way that things should be done and that each student needs to take a proactive approach intead of waiting for the SU to do everything for them because they probably won't do anything anyway.

by Eoin Dubsky Wed Nov 13, 2002 02:00

I think a silent protest can be a great idea, and is particularly appropriate here.

To sit or stand in silence with others can be a very empowering experience too... or like standing about repeating slogans, it can also be boring and soul-crushing... there's no "one size fits all" type of protest.

From what I know of the scene in DCU I'm guessing that the TCD SU are facing:

a) An apathetic student body (so numbers will always be difficult),

b) Many conservatives in union council and even on the SU exec, who simply won't support a 'loud' demo,

c) A brief (time, space) opportunity to get their message across to the Minister and others around.

In light of the above, I think that a silent protest -- deafening silence -- could be a dignified and powerful action. A large coalition of student groups in Germany did something like this -- they got about 2,000 or more students to walk up to some building in total silence -- and it helped them win their campaign (it wasn't about fees, but it was something else to do with access to education).

Good luck to everyone involved!!

by pat c Wed Nov 13, 2002 11:36

"i never suggested that flying pickets would not be silent."

iosaf, perhaps yogic flyers could hum a mantra?

on the silent picket itself, this has been done in the past. tcdsu had decided on a previous occasion to have a silent protest when ministers were visiting. THIS WAS OUT OF RESPECT TO THE STUDENTS & STAFF IN LIBRARIES AND FOR THOSE SITTING & STUDYING FOR EXAMS.

When SWSS breached this, they came in for a lot of criticism, from ordinary students, not just ff haccks.. Its difficult to see what could be acheived by a small group noisily barracking a minister if the end result is that they succeed in alienating a lot of other students.

by iosaf Wed Nov 13, 2002 13:23

I did not suggest that flying pickets would do anything which might involve them in criminal proceedings thus I was deftly avoiding "agent provacateurism". I think Fingin and the UCD militants and indeed their equivalent in TCD would recognise such a "ruse" when they read one. I have never advocated yogic flying as a protest methodology I prefer loud protests for such events. If I were in an "agent provacateurist" mood I might even suggest the odd "common assault" with eggs and custard pies. I might even go further and suggest sabateurs render the entrance at Lincoln Gate impassable. But I´m not in that mood Pat, not today anyway.

by Dubsky Debater Wed Nov 13, 2002 13:25

I find it amazing to see Eoin Dubsky lining up with SU careerists and FF hacks on the debate over silent demos. I agree that silent demos can have their place (I dont know where, but I'm not ruling them out). But to say that it's a good idea to have a silent protest for the Minister for Education on a fees demo is wrong!

The Minister should be shouted at, he should be blockaded. He should know the anger that exists among students.

To say students are apathetic is wrong. If the SU launched a fighting militant protest against the minister and they mounted a serious campaign then the majority of students would get involved.

by hs sp Wed Nov 13, 2002 13:39

I thought the swp were big in TCD, where the hell are they? If theres one thing they can do it is organise a loud protest. whats happened to them? Have they all decided to join the peace and love camp after florence?

by pat c Wed Nov 13, 2002 14:37

iosaf, the most yogic fliers would get is a suspended sentence.

maybe specially trained pigeons to dive bomb & peck out the eyes of ministers?

i seem to remember barcelona having lots of the winged rats. send a few eta trained pigeons over & they could be infiltrated into tcd.

by iosaf Wed Nov 13, 2002 15:20

pigeon is paloma in spanish
i am presently broadcasting on FM 91.4
as ipsiphi with a wonderful girl
who calls herself Paloma
we´ll say hello to D&C for you.

by iosaf Wed Nov 13, 2002 15:20

pigeon is paloma in spanish
i am presently broadcasting on FM 91.4
as ipsiphi with a wonderful girl
who calls herself Paloma
we´ll say hello to D&C for you.

by Shane - SYTCD Wed Nov 13, 2002 16:10

While were on the subject the TCDSU has proposed a referendum on to end affiliation to the USI. President Prestley is calling for a yes vote. More worrying however is that the SU is now pushing forward a referendum in which it will be proposing that any decision made on a referendum with a turn out of under 10% will be will be void.

On the "protest", the SU only want SU members too attend. Lovely isnt it

by Finghin - Socialist Youth UCD Wed Nov 13, 2002 16:25

Patrick Mc Hugh the Equality Officer of ULSU seems to think I'm in favour of building on areas on conservation. I don't know why he thinks that from my posting or any other postings I have ever put up.

I think silent protests can have their place but this is not the right situation for such a demo. Students are very angry about the prospect of fees and will respond to militant and livley demos.

The reason the TCDSU want a silent demo is not because they beleive it will have the most effect and mobilise students the reason is that they are tied to the establishment parties and don't want to embarass their co-thinkers in government.

Student in TCD should now push their union to take proper action and if they are unwilling to do so organise it themselves. The SWSS did it last time and recieved a bit of critisism of a few hacks and careerist union councillors, but they are not representative of students. Most student will support a loud noisy demo regardless of what the careerists in the union think.

On the question of USI disaffiliation, FF dominated UCDSU are having a disaffiliation referendum campaign too. Of course the USI is not the best organisation it is bureacratic and undemocratic etc however it is the only national union. It would weaken the students movement should TCD and UCD disaffiliate as there is no other alternative fighting national union. For that reason Socialist Youth are calling for No votes in those referenda.

by tellin ya Wed Nov 13, 2002 22:01

im tellin ya, the best thing to so is be silent right up til the end then someone jump out dressed as death with a fake scythe and everyone scream as loud as they can! with any luck it'll give the mutherfucker a heart attack.

or alternatively, if any has ever seen the film pancho villas, theres a part in it where all the village folk surround the state forces and start to hum 'la coucaracha' - y'know like the two crows in them old warner brothers cartoons? its fucking brilliant. that'd put the shits up him.

by Intransigent Thu Nov 14, 2002 01:36

Despite their plans to keep it silent even the SU felt extremely pathetic so there was some chanting. But we all knew that was gonna happen anyway. The SU are feeling the pressure from students who are angry and don't want to conform with their weak tactics.