RSF Supports Protest Action By Prisoners In Maghaberry.

by Hebert Woods Thu Jun 22, 2006 15:43

MG, you misconstrue. I have no connection with RSF and don’t agree with them.
'John' pretends to be a supporter of Sinn Fein and picks a fight with RSF by insulting their prisoners and makes comments that no SF member would make about republican prisoners (not even ones they disagree with). He feeds RSF prejudice about SF. In the past these cops pretended to be supporters of RSF (‘Blanketman’was one).
This is just a new wrinkle. They are cops.

by Donnchadh Thu Jun 22, 2006 15:12

Im afraid MG it is you who is deluded if you believe that RSF was founded in 1986. According to Section 1b of the Sinn Féin constitution in 1986 proposals supporting the entering of Leinster House were banned. Before Adams and Co. put forward a motion to enter Leinster House they needed to change Section 1b by a majority vote. They did not do this so Mr. Adam’s motion to enter Leinster House was breaking the existing Sinn Féin constitution. In fact the article said that no member who proposed or supported entering Leinster House could stay in the party, so Gerry Adams disqualified himself and his supporters from membership of Sinn Féin. Brian Feeney, in his book, Sinn Féin 100 Turbulent Years, puts forward the argument that Adams had managed to bypass Section 1b, by introducing a motion in 1983 allowing the “discussion” of any aspect of the Sinn Féin constitution. This change may indeed have facilitated debate on abstentionism but it did not infringe on the content or effect of Section 1b in any way.
Section 1b was still operative in 1986, its wording was: "No person....who approves of or supports the candidature of persons who sign any form or give any kind of written or verbal undertaking of intention to take their seats in these institutions (Leinster House, Stormont, Westminster), shall be admitted to membership or allowed to retain membership." The line "no aspect of the constitution and rules be closed to discussion," added by Adams in 1983 according to Feeney, would seem, at first glance, to conflict with section 1b. There is, however, a substantial difference between "discussing" the the rule barring the taking of seats in Leinster House (an aspect of the constitution and rules) and formally "approving" or "supporting" the "candidature of persons who sign any form or give any kind of written or verbal undertaking of intention to take their seats in these institutions." For example, conventions are held regularly where drug addiction is discussed without any of the delegates proposing or supporting it.
Its clear that if this line allowing the discussion of any aspect of the constitution was indeed adopted, it did not, in any way, infringe on or vitiate Section 1b (which was still recognised by Adams himself in 1986 to the point that he proposed amending it to continue its effect in regard to Stormont and Westminster only.) The only purpose there could have been to adopting such a line emphatically allowing the discussion of any aspect of the constitution would have been to prevent an overly restrictive interpretation of Section 1b. Adams and his supporters expelled themselves from Sinn Féin by proposing Motion 162 (which proposed and supported entry to Leinster House) before they had amended section Section 1b. by a majority vote. There is no question of Ó Brádaigh and his supporters loosing any vote, since once Adams and Co. had expelled themselves from the party only those who opposed Motion 162 were still members of Sinn Féin. That the remaining members of Sinn Féin walked out of a room full of self expelled persons and re- convened in another place is hardly surprising. Of course Adams and his supporters continued on, but not as the same legal or traditional entity. It would be more accurate to call them New PSF.

by MG Thu Jun 22, 2006 10:58

Well done HW you have shown everybody that you are paranoid and deluded. No go off and try and sell your paper. You'll see that nobody else is interested in your delusions.

by Herbert Woods Thu Jun 22, 2006 10:46

'John' above, a cop, does a cut and paste of his cop intervention from

http://www.indymedia.ie/article/76757&comment_limit=0&c...54813

You are being manipulated by a cop.

After being exposed previously with their stupid 1-2 sentence contributions, they have seen the need to expand, but the effort is too much and results in repetition of their stupid cop thoughts aimed at manipulating the innocent and unwary.

Don't be manipulated.

by MG Thu Jun 22, 2006 10:04

A small number of people left the Ard Fheis in 1986 after the vote didn't go their way, RSF was the new party they formed in 1986, and now in 2006 after 20 years of "real republicanism" RSF have no popular support. I wouldn't call RSF dissidents I would call them irrelevant as does everybody else. Also what test did you take to prove that you are a "real republican", is this test available online? Pathetic statements like that show just how far removed from reality RSF are. Go off and try and sell your papers, try and double your sales, surely people would be interested in reading "real republicanism"?

by Donnchadh Thu Jun 22, 2006 03:57

John is a bit confused as well - he says the Irish people are following the leadership of New PSF? Even after their ignominious surrender to the Brits and jumping through every hoop the Unionists can think off, they still have only about eight per cent support in the free state - thats a whole 3% more than they had when they were lead by a real Republican - Ruirí Ó Brádaigh, and Section 31 in full swing. Im sure if RSF tailored their policies to the latest opinion poll like New PSF (founded in 1986 when Adams and Co. broke section 1b. of the constitution and expelled themselves from Sinn Féin) do, then they could get at least 8% too.

by Donnchadh Thu Jun 22, 2006 03:42

John is talking exactly the way you would expect from "poachers turned gamekeepers." Remember that DeValera didnt stop at calling republicans "dissidents with no support" he hung them too - didnt even give them a soldier's death like the Brits nearly gave him. There's nothing like the zeal of the convert. The Free Staters were ten times worse than the Black and Tans ever were. The stickies went on the rampage too murdering republicans. Maybe John could make some money in Maghaberry. When Gerry and Martin tell their followers its all right to join the Brit occupation forces, John can apply for a job as a screw. No doubt he will put the Orange men to shame when it comes to abusing the POWs. Yes indeed, there's nothing like the zeal of the convert.

by Pepsi Wed Jun 21, 2006 20:10

Silly people, don't you know that Sinn Fein owns the copyright to anything associated with 1981?

by Support the POWs Wed Jun 21, 2006 19:14

John, You seem to be unaware the Hunger strikers of 81 (not including the 3 affiliated with the IRSP of course) were part of the Republican Movement, a movement that was (is) 100% politically and idealogically identical (trad. Republicanism, abstentionism,Eire Nua etc) and with (an important point) a Republican leadership. That Republicanism is today solely represented by RSF and the wider Republican Movement, including CIRA/Ogliagh na hEireann. Now we can say maybe in all likelyhood they may or may not have followed the path of Adams, but at the time of their deaths they were RM, not psf-post 86. Remember too, that political status was signed away by the provos, rights earned by the prisoners thrown away for political expediancy and a few shillings. Was never theirs to give away. Anyway, everyone should get behind the Republican prisoners , political prisoners deserve political status.

Republican Prisoners 1981
Republican Prisoners 2006

Political Status Now

by John Wed Jun 21, 2006 15:23

The current dissident prisoners are trying to copy history for their own selfish gains. They see how much the Irish people respect the true Republicans of history who struggled their whole lives when war was necessary.

Now that way is over and for this phase of the struggle the people need political leadership. Republicans are doing this excellently in the name of Sinn Féin.

The current dissidents have no support. People commenting on this website and RSF and 32CSM are mentioning the 1981 Hunger Strike and the Hungerstrikers as if there is a similarity.

The only connection between 1981 and the dissidents is that the dissidents are trying to copy history, when times have completely changed. The times have changed because of the hard work of the Republicans of history. The dissidents are not part of the same movement. They are of small groups of copy cats who are only in it for themselves. By doing this they try to change history to read that they are similar to our patriot dead. They are not. All our patriot dead had died in rebellions when the Irish people rose up to fight British Imperialism. Now the Irish people are engaging in political action in the name of Sinn Féin.

Sinn Féin are committed to representing the Irish people and will continue to do so.

by Pól Mac Wed Jun 21, 2006 14:07

SF passed a motion at this years ard fheis to support these republican P.O.W.s. any ogra member of SF must stand up and recognoise these men's right for political status. over 25 years on, the fight for political status goes on. that britian might brand irelands fight 800 years of crime

by Jackie Wed Jun 21, 2006 02:46

I'm saddened to learn of the on-going plight of the republican prisoners in Maghaberry. It's hard to believe that 25 years on from the tragic deaths of the brave hunger strikers the campaign for political status has to recommence.

On reading the five demands of the political prisoners they appear to me to be very basic human rights demands to be treated humanely, and those responsible for holding these prisoners are guilty of gross misconduct and human rights violations and should be imprisoned themselves.

I wish the very best of luck to the republican prisoners with their protest and hope that those responsible for detaining them will see the error of their ways and grant these political prisoners all of their five demands to be treated in a humane manner - any decent person would.

No doubt this protest needs to be highlighted more and I have no doubt at all that it will.

Ádh mór oraibh!

by Support the POWs Wed Jun 21, 2006 02:35

Support the POWs.

by Donnchadh Wed Jun 21, 2006 02:26

Given the history of the Republican Movement its far from unlikely that an Adams/Mcguinness/De Valera like faction will eventually emerge in Republican Sinn Féin and CIRA, but whats equally sure is that there will always be men and women of principle and honour like Ruirí Ó Brádaigh who will not be lead down the primrose path of British constitutionalism and who will continue the struggle until the 32 county Irish Republic is reinstated. Fool me once shame on you (1922 The Treaty of Surrender)- Fool me twice(1927 De Valera), three times (1946 Clann na Poblachta), four times (1986 The Adams Party) - Do republicans ever learn? But the Continuity has not been broken, despite all efforts.

by Willie Tue Jun 20, 2006 22:04

Is jj really that stupid? If he read my post he would see that far from being a Provie [ I by the way was once proud to be a member of PIRA ] I am actually criticising the Leadership of P Sinn Fein and advising against making the mistake of staying in an organisation who will more than likely follow Sinn Fein down the Stickie path when the suits fit.

by jj Tue Jun 20, 2006 21:27

I just reread that post, and i bellieve it wasnt willie, but some provie playing at "intell". Apologies to willie G.

by jj Tue Jun 20, 2006 21:25

Its very sad to read some of these posts. One is from the regular contributer from provo ogra who is vattacking these prisoners. these men are Republican prisoners. A member of a so-called Republican youth group. FFS. Can only hope it opens more eyes to what the provisionals have become. He's ready to join the modern day broy harriers. Pathetic.

Then we have a comment, that I hope is not actually from willie g from strabane, because if it is, a chara, those words you wrote will not be forgotten. Trust me. I

by Willy Tue Jun 20, 2006 20:33

As an ex-prisoner who was on the blanket I would advise those young prisoners [ Political Prisoners that is ] to concentrate on getting out of jail and back to their families. 10 brave men died [and only then did we get the support of the community ] countless more Volunteers died on the streets and in the fields of our occupied country and for what, so a leadership whom we trusted without question could eventually abandon it all[ weapons and the Army] for a place in Government in that still occupied country. You are only wasting your lives.

by John Tue Jun 20, 2006 20:14

Sad this is occuring 25years after 10 brave men died on a prision protest which effectivly won status, and then it was given away with the signing of the GFA in 1998.

I hope the men get their demands before this gets that far, but knowing the brits any thing is possible

by Sean Oglach Tue Jun 20, 2006 20:13

Over 25 years ago the likes of the SDLP were saying that the men of 1916 had the support of the community but those striving for Political Status had no such support. Now we have Republicans saying that those Republicans now engaged in a struggle for Political Status haven't the support of the community. Well they mightn't have the support of the community for a war well and truly sold out by the present Leadership of supposed Republicanism [ They might as well throw plastic bottles at armoured cars as try and revive this war.] but they are POLITICAL PRISONERS, just as political as Bobby Sands.

by Frank Tue Jun 20, 2006 20:09

I hope everyone who calls themselves a Republican gets behind the POW's in Maghaberry.

by johnny Tue Jun 20, 2006 20:04

dont dare try and connect the young men of 1981 to these idiotic misled fools of the contos

by no Tue Jun 20, 2006 20:02

the 10 hunger strikers who died in 1981 had the support of the communities they came from, this was proved by the massive vote for Sinn Féin at the time of their elections. they dissenting from British rule, not their own people. The people of Ireland supported them.

by by who???? Tue Jun 20, 2006 19:42

25 years ago there were 10 wannabe, who became reluctant heros. Grant Political Status NOW.

by me Tue Jun 20, 2006 19:31

25 years ago was completely different. the prisoners had the support of the community. the ones now that claim to be like the ones years ago are wee wannabes.