Kunle Faces Court As Car Seized

by Caoimhe Kerins - Residents Against Racism Mon Aug 01, 2005 14:03

This story appears to be the exact same one that appeared on the front of the Evening Herald last week.

In true Evening Herald tyle, this story is untrue. Kunle is not facing 'a court appearance' nor was he charged with driving without tax and insurance.

by Al Mon Aug 01, 2005 14:09

Its section 41 not 31 RTA 61/02 for seizing cars. He will be summoned to court in a month or so time not charged. He wont face any charges over tax if he did just buy the car and as long as he produces his license thats fine but he will be prosecuted for no insurance.

by redjade Tue Aug 02, 2005 14:56

''Kunie was charged with
not carrying his official ID
card and spent the night in
custody before being
released. He has denied any
involvement in the fraud bid''

I wonder if this is the same 'ID Card' that is not to be used as an 'ID Card'?

Image from:
http://www.indymedia.ie/newswire.php?story_id=64261

For Asylum Seekers: an ID Card that is not an ID Card

by neutral Tue Aug 02, 2005 16:39

Caoimhe/JD, I understand your concerns, but has the Herald really made all this up...? Is there any truth to it at all?

Even if he did buy a car and hadnt got it taxed or insured, its not a reason for deportation, but it does look bad considering there was reports saying he had no money whatsoever when he was deported back to Nigeria. Cars arent cheap...

by explain Tue Aug 02, 2005 19:16

Has he actually been arrested?

What was the charge?

seems like the Herald story is just bluff - shite newspaper.

by Major Woody Tue Aug 02, 2005 20:00

Response to hidden comments removed - IMC Ed

The story itself is a bit of a non-story. Drivers get told to produce their papers all the time at the local cop-shop - happened to a friend of mine last week. Richard / Sean / Liam / Marcus gives himself away by pretending this is a big deal - I suppose he takes the TV licence ads seriously as well!

The only thing of interest here is how such a non-story ended up in two newspapers. A government or Gardai leak you have to presume designed precisely to delight bigots like Richard / Sean / Liam / Marcus

by Duine Wed Aug 03, 2005 18:49

Is maith atá an fear seo ábalta nead a dhéanamh i gcluais phobal na hÉireann.

by Motormouth Wed Aug 03, 2005 20:41

I have no idea about the Kunle story or how commonplace driving without insurance is in the general population is but my car was hit by a Nigerian guy with no tax or insurance as I was getting my son out of the back seat earlier this year.

It was the the closest I've ever come to buying the farm as the door was half torn off the car. My reaction was amazement that I was unhurt rather than anger etc. In fairness to the guy he was very apologetic and waited around for the cops and instead of legging it and rang up several times afterwards to inquire if we were OK.

You can imagine that it is a big expense for immigrants to shell out for insurance and the temptation to have your own independence is great.

Shouldn't there be some sort of initiative to inform immigrants that they cant drive without insurance and secondly to provide some sort of low-cost insurance to make sure they are covered?

Given the problems with joy riding in cheap cars etc. shouldn't the legal onus be on the seller of a car to ensure his/herself that the buyer has the necessary insurance before handing over the keys? That was the case in point here as the guy had just bought the car from someone who came down from the north and was driving it a few hunred yards to park outside his apartment building.

by Al Wed Aug 03, 2005 22:27

In response to some questions.

A, No that is not the ID card. Thats a refugee card in the picture, absolutely no effort is put into verifying a persons identity when they are issued. ID is a passport or GNIB card, shows ignorance of the situation on your part.

B, the vast majority of countries require insurance in cars. The "I didnt know" policy simple doesnt wash.

C, He wasnt simple asked to produce documents, he didnt have any to produce. He will face charges for this.

D, The onus is on the person that will actually be driving the car. Why should the person selling it be responsible? what if fake documents are produced at the time of purchase? Whos to blame then?

Bottom line, you all would be pretty pissed off if an uninsured driver smashed into you, he might be a nice guy but its still you thats up the creek with no paddle.

by Mannix Fri Aug 05, 2005 06:59 mannixstreetpreacher at gmail dot com

This story is obviously a plant and is mostly made up. Where is the editorial control over this stuff? Or its verification? Consider:

1) It gets the guy's name wrong - constantly. Kunie Elunhana? It's Kunle Elukanlo.

2) The only place the name Kunie Elunhana appears elswhere on the Internet is in a story on a nazi site (Name of nazi site removed as indymedia.ie operates a "no platform" policy" - Editor) - posted 07-28-2005, 12:32 PM, the day *before* it appears on indymedia.ie (Jul 29 2005, 1:51am). Even the line breaks are the same!

3) There is no accreditation for the source of the original story. Where's the URL?

4) Most of the story is a mish-mash of comments from two stories - one in the (Irish) Examiner called "Teachers ‘disgusted’ by reports linking Kunle to suspected fraud case" (http://newsfeed.tcm.ie/irishexaminer/story.asp?j=309194485655&p=3x9y9448647x&n=309194486541) and the other from the Sunday Independent called "Have the fame and fortune gone to Kunle's head?" (http://www.unison.ie/irish_independent/index.php3?issue_id=12319). The rest can't be verified.

Again - to the original poster. What's the source of the balance of the story?

Of course, if residentsagainstracism.org bothered to keep their website up to date, the information could easily be countered or refuted, instead of the current debate on this site. But rar.org hasn't had a news update since May...

by Alan Fri Aug 05, 2005 09:19

Mannix,

I don't think this is a plant, that is a paranoid reaction to something you obviously don't want to be reading. I think your sympathy would run out for him if he hit you or a member of your family with his uninsured car.

Driving without Insurance is a serious offence, not akin to not having a TV licence as an earlier poster had compared it with. The consequences for this gentleman will be felt when he tries to get an extension to his Visa, this was already unlikely before this.

by Duine Fri Aug 05, 2005 17:27

Molaim do Kunle dlí a chur ar mhuintir an Herald agus cúiteamh a éileamh.

by Reality Check Fri Aug 05, 2005 18:17

Mannix, the original story about Kunle's arrest at Dublin Airport was also an Evening Herald story. The Irish Examiner article you refer to was a follow-up to it.
Kunle's names is mis-spelt in the Evening Herald report but not as badly as you are making out - some of the error has occurred in the transcription.
That is immaterial anyway.
The Evening Herald is not online but I have a copy of the original right here in front of me, it's from Thursday July 28 and I'm sure you can get a copy of it, if you are sufficiently eager.
Also, in an interview in Ireland on Sunday on July 31, Kunle admitted that his car had been seized. He said: 'I didn't and don't have E3,000 for the insurance.'
Neither the Evening Herald nor Ireland on Sunday have received legal correspondence from Kunle disputing the facts in these stories.
None of this changes the fact that he should be allowed to stay in Ireland having been forced to wait an unacceptable three years for an adjudication on his asylum claim.
But stop looking for conspiracies where there are none. Kunle is obviously not an angel and I don't think anyone ever said he was.

by Alan Sat Aug 06, 2005 10:25

Reality,

Thank's for giving Mannix a good spanking, he deserved it, his facts were all rubbish and didn't add up. However I have one fact for you, Kunle is not going to be given asylum in Ireland - he's here until the end of september on a visa. Kunle had to behave himself if he was to have any chance of getting an extension to his visa, he hasn't as you said youreself been an angel.

by the plain people of ireland Sat Aug 06, 2005 11:40

Yes indeed that would be a very laudable project.

Perhaps, though one might try to do something in this regard for the native "aborigines" before helping out the immigrants and asylum-seekers ...

After all the obscene profit margins of Irish insurers are well known.
http://www.lawlibrary.ie/viewdoc.asp?Docid=43&Catid=14&StartDate=1+January+2005&m=b

http://www.rte.ie/comments/insurancehigh.html

Or would that be too politically incorrect and discriminatory for your taste ?

by Reality Check Sat Aug 06, 2005 11:41

I have to disagree with you. I don't think Minister McDowell will deport him because he knows he will face an enormous protest. Whatever about Kunle's misbehaviour, a three-year wait for an asylum adjudication is not acceptable and that, I believe, is the major difficulty in the case.

I'm not trying to give Mannix a good spanking. I just find it intolerable that an article in the Evening Herald is not considered reliable, considering the massively restrictive libel laws that newspapers in this country operate under, yet links to websites and blogs nobody has ever heard are considered gospel on Indymedia.

Residents Against Racism consistently say articles are bullsh** on the basis that ages might be wrong or names spelled incorrectly.
Considering, I know for a fact that Kunle has given different ages to different people and the simple fact that people aren't used to spelling African names contribute to this. It's their classic tactic of pointing out minor irrelevant details hoping to plant a seed of doubt.

But I would ask RAR this in the sure knowledge that they won't answer?

Was Kunle's car seized?
Was he driving without tax and insurance?
Do they believe that is acceptable behaviour for anybody?

by Reality Check Fri Aug 12, 2005 13:52

It simply never fails to amaze me how threads like this fall into a Bermuda Triangle without simple legitimate questions being answered.

by Check back into reality Fri Aug 12, 2005 14:06

Go ask Kunle yourself. RAR were not asked by Kunle for help in any of this nor did RAR contact Kunle about this. You are completely deluding yourself if you think RAR have a position on people driving without insurance.

Needless to say Kunle will be punished by a fine of around €300 a deserved slap on the knuckles if the story is true. It will not affect his case and he will be staying for a very long time.

by rar supporter Fri Aug 12, 2005 15:11

Should he get deported? He endangered life. Thousands and thousands of young bloods go easy on the technicalities of driving legislation here. Should K be made an example of because he learned this slipshod and nod and wink approach to driving legalities from most likely his irish peers?

Why special treatment? Because he's black/nigerian?

by rar supporter Fri Aug 12, 2005 15:35

I've witnessed many a youngfella being treated leniently 'probation act etc' for motoring offenses by judges on basis of people testifying they are of good character.

Should the same defense not be available to K?

Or is he too black/nigerian?

Do you accept that people of good character black or not sometimes commit motoring offences?

by Reality Check Fri Aug 12, 2005 16:20

I agree with all of the above three posters. It's not a major offence.
What I cannot accept is that RAR came on here and said the original story was "bullsh**" when it quite clearly wasn't.

by Sherlock Holmes Fri Aug 12, 2005 16:29

What Caoimhe said was that he was not charged with the offence, which he hadn't been.

by Noel Fri Aug 12, 2005 16:36

Thats mere playing with words, as has been explained he will be summonsed to answer for the offence,

dont agree either that its a minor offence, tell that to someone who has been hit by an uninsured driver.

Stop making this a race thing and focus on the fact that a young lad broke the law and should be punished regardless of colour

He and other no doubt are playing the race card,

by rar supporter Fri Aug 12, 2005 16:40

"They're all guilty until proven innocent"

nuff said mr. troll

by Noel Fri Aug 12, 2005 16:47

I never said anything like you assert,

It is true he was stopped and will be summonsed, he will face a court who will decide if he is innocent or guilty,

stop making this a race thing,

the guard was correct to stop this young lad and take the car if it was uninsured. It would happen to you or me or anyone else

It dosnt matter to mean whether this lad was black, white, green, blure orange or any other colour for that matter

Apparently you are asserting that because he is coloured he should get special treatment, thats not equality, being treated equally is allowing the process to be fully followed through without playing the race card.

by rar supporter Fri Aug 12, 2005 16:55

"a young lad broke the law and should be punished"

All decided by you before a trial. Guilty until proven innocent like I said. Just like all asylum seekers are 'bogus' before they get a hearing in your way of thinking.

You ARE a racist in my opinion and I'm entitled to it.

Go troll at politics.ie

by Noel Fri Aug 12, 2005 17:06

And I fully agree with your right to have your opinion and never said you were not entitled to it but calling people names and shouting at them to leave the arena might make good headlines and adhere you to some fringe elements it does not allow for a reasoned and adult debate.

In my opinion, I am not a rascist and would fully support granting of asylum to many more people, Ireland has in my opinion benefitted from becomming more mutli cultural and the current assylum procedures are despicable and draconian. However, ranting and shouting at people who dont automatically agree with you does no justice to the peple looking for assylum,

just like making a motoring case a refugee/racism issue does nobody justice. The real fault here is with the Evening Herald for running this tripe as a story but keeping it going as a race issue is wrong.

As regars guilty until proven innocent, I think most observers agree that the law appears to have been broken.

Again this is just my opinion, and I am entitled to it

by Reality Check Fri Aug 12, 2005 17:50

The only reason the Evening Herald considers this a story is because Kunle and his campaign quite deliberately and quite rightly targetted the media to highlight his case thus making him something of a minor celebrity.
Unfortunately, using the media in this fashion is a double-edged sword.
While newspaper and TV coverage were instrumental in getting Kunle back into Ireland, the flipside to this is that he - more than any other asylum seeker - then needs to keep a low profile then.
It is not racist to report on the seizure of the car and his run-in with the law.
It is also not a question of innocence or guilt. Kunle has already himself admitted the offence publicly. It's only RAR and supporters that dispute this.
The story is simply a case of reporting on the latest developments in the case of the country's best-known asylum seeker.
All we are seeing in this forum is the continuing use of colour to muddy the waters.
In Ireland however, the race card is the trump card. Once played, no other opinion is valid, only racist.

by Al Fri Aug 12, 2005 17:58

very true Reality, very true.
The bottom line is he admitted the offence, he will eventually end up in court and will probable get a fine and suspended sentense. This in turn will effect his attempts to stay in Ireland regardless of how he attempts to stay.
And once again the only people speaking about colour are those attempting to defend the accused and blame everyone else.

by Robin Piggott - Astral School of Motoring Thu Sep 15, 2005 18:58 info at astralmotoring dot ie

Thought I would post my opinions in response to the article on Driving Offenses by an immigrant. Of course we have quite enough homegrown uninsured Drivers without importing more problems from around the World.
If immigrants are going to come and settle in Ireland then they should be required to learn ,absorb and obey all the Laws. Ignorance of the Law is not an excuse and should,t be tolerated under any circumstances.
I was approached in a busy hotel carpark last week by an Asian Man who was teaching his four year old the complexities of navigating a busy carpark on a trycycle.Its a miracle the child is still alive! His English was so bad as to be comical as he attempted to ask the price of Driving Lessons,which he then queried argumentatively.
There is absolutely no justification for allowing such persons on the road in charge of a lethal weapon.Mandatory standard of English should be required to begin with and of course there is no hope whatsoever of this person passing a Driving Test.He just wouldn't understand the Examiners instructions.
I think it's a good thing that we invite other Nationalities to participate in our new-found prosperity but as for driving that's another day's work. We are endeavouring to help all learner drivers with articles published on the web and with two blogs currently http://astralmotoring.blogspot.com and http://astraldrivingschool.blogs.ie

by Al Fri Sep 30, 2005 20:17

He got another 6 months. Doesnt seem to have been mentioned anywhere else.

It looks to me like he will be around until hes finished college at least and by then will be able to contribute to the state coffers so will be granted permission to remain.

by wedo Fri Sep 30, 2005 20:45

.

by Eamon Dunphy's Hairdresser Sat Oct 08, 2005 22:47

So, for all the shouting by Residents Against Racism, we now find that Kunle is free to attend third level college in this country, despite some alleged dodgy dealings...

And yesterday, we had the acquital of Osagie Igbinidion, a Nigerian who circumcised a baby boy in Ireland, who later died from blood loss. The judge told the jury: "You can not bring your white western values to bear when deciding this case."

Who says Ireland is institutionally racist? If it is, then the bureaucracy is making progess. The judge. Kevin Haugh deserves special congratulations...

by Someone who didn't miss the point Sat Oct 08, 2005 23:18

If it wasn't for RAR and Kunle's classmates, he would have stayed deported. If RAR weren't around Ireland would be much worse

by lemon glass. Wed Jan 25, 2006 23:30

From further back up the thread:

"Needless to say Kunle will be punished by a fine of around €300 a deserved slap on the knuckles if the story is true. It will not affect his case and he will be staying for a very long time."

I dont support anyone being deported. I think people should be allowed stay and live where they want. But Michael McDowell doesnt agree with me. And he's the one with the authority and the power of the state behind him to enforce the deportations. People should be (and by this stage, MUST be) aware of that.

A friend of mine was living illegally somewhere recently. He was lucky enough to get a job. He kept his head down so much it was painful. The next door neighbours one night were hammering and banging, like they were doing DIY, at 4am. He knocked on the door and asked them to stop. The resident came out and asked him who he was, if he was supposed to be living in the building, what his landlord's name was, etc. He then realised he had so much more to lose than a night's sleep - his home, his job, his new friends - so he bit his tongue and went back inside.

Kunle was fortunate enough that he had committed people and friends who were willing to go out there and campaign to get him back. He was deported once - and he was brought back. Surely that would be enough to make you keep your head down, and not be driving around in a car without tax and insurance. RTE are reporting that this was not his first traffic offence either, and this was taken into account when giving him the new deportation order.

Its not even about silencing political dissent. I'd have more respect for him if he had been out there campaigning alongside RAR and others against the deportation of Pamela Izevbekhai, Olivia Agbonlahor, etc, and putting himself on the blockades on Burgh Quay, but he wasnt. Instead he was caught driving around in a dodgy car, something I have no respect for having been knocked off my bike a couple of times and a family member being involved in a car accident. Sorry but my tolerance of motorists who dont give a fuck about other road usuers is near nil, regardless of their nationality.

He's probably fucked up his chances of staying here now. Its sad and regrettable, but its inevitable with McDowell, and Kunle should have, nay must have been conscious of this. I was working late this evening and the news was coming in. Of course it only fed more into the horrible stereotype of "all them Nigerians are driving around without any tax and insurance on their cars" (which someone in work said quietly in the tea station). What response did I have? None. Nobody had any sympathy for him, and I dont think a new campaign will find as much favour as before his Leaving Cert.

Just my €0.02. Good night...

by gay geori Thu Jan 26, 2006 01:39 gg at bearla dot ie

the traffic offences are irrelevant to the deportation proceedings. are you trying to tell us that if he had become a driving school instructor that he'd be allowed stay.

Perhaps it's case where we SHOULD bring "white western values to bear when deciding this case"... after all, 25% of drunk driving arrests go nowhere... and his driving is no worse a record that some government ministers...


he's young and foolish, but that's not a reason to weigh into this case. he should be granted irish citizenship immediately.

by kevin Thu Jan 26, 2006 02:00

This case is a slam dunk for the dept of justice, there is nothing to stop his deportation (except if he leaves himself)

He has made a show of the people who campaigned on his behalf, very few (except rar and his friends) will make an effort this time. You can't get an american visa if your'e a criminal, why should he get an irish visa?

by Sideshowbob Thu Jan 26, 2006 10:04

Games up, fair play to you Kunle, you played a stormer around the course but not many horses fall 3 times in the Grand national and still get back up with their jockey still clinging on.. but somehow i don't think this stallion will be led off the course quietly...

by Duine Thu Jan 26, 2006 16:02

Cad é an fhírinne i leith mo dhuine?

An bhfuil sé le fanacht nó le cur amach?

by gay geori Mon Jan 30, 2006 14:01 gg at bearla dot ie

There appears to be some conflict of opinion as to the support of Kunle. last week in the irish times we had RAR saying there would be protests against his deportation. Then in the evening herald, he was quoted as saying he was resigned to going, and his supported agreed.

Kunle has been left to twist in the wind...

by Duine Mon Jan 30, 2006 17:34

Ach nach é seo an mac léinn a chríochnaigh an ardteist agus a fuair áit ar chúrsa innealtóireachta éigin?

Tuige an hum ann is an hum as ag an Aire?