An interview with Haim Shur

national | miscellaneous | news report Monday July 08, 2002 22:11 by Agus

Haim Shur is a well-known intellectual leader and veteran of Israel's peace camp. He is the former Editor of Israel's Socialist Party ("Mapam") daily "Al Ha'mishmar," and "The New Outlook," the English journal of Israel's Left which called for a dialogue with the PLO and for the establishment of an independent Palestinian state before anyone else did, during the 1980s.

An Intellectual Leader and Veteran of Israel's Left and Peace Camp: 'Arafat is an Arch-Liar, an Arch Murderer'. In a comprehensive interview with Ma'ariv, Shur claimed that the Palestinians deceived and manipulated Israel's peace camp. He stated he has recently come to realize that the entire peace process was a part of the Palestinian phased plan to destroy Israel, admitted he believes the Israeli Left was misleading the Israeli public, and that there are no chances for peace in the near future. Following are excerpts from Shur's interview:

"During the last few years, 75 year-old Shur is witnessing the ideals which shaped his life and thoughts crumbling down one after the other right in front of his own eyes: the Ha'Shomer-Ha'tzair [pioneer Israeli Socialist youth movement], the Kibbutz [the Israeli Socialist farming community], Socialism, the Left, and the brotherhood of nations. The last few months produced another painful disillusionment; Shur...is feeling deceived."

"[Shur said:] the Palestinians deceived me personally and the entire Israeli Left as well. They lied to us, they scammed us, maneuvered and manipulated us. Personally, I will never forgive them for this. My respect for Yossi Beilin is severely damaged when he says that he had already concluded with them a mutually accepted formula on the refugee issue, because if he is still incapable of ascertaining what is going on here than he is not really a man of the Left. A genuine man of the Left is a man who should accept the reality for what it is, and not see it the way he wishes to. The Palestinians are not yet ripe for peace, and my duty as a man of the Left is to realize this truth. The Left is not a synonym for deceit."

Q: "In what way did the Palestinians deceive you personally?"
A: "I had countless meetings with Palestinians. If someone conducted a study on the top ten Israelis who visited Palestinians most frequently I am sure I would be among them. [I met with Palestinians] more frequently than Shimon Peres, Yossi Beilin, and Ron Pundak did. During all of my meetings with them, the Palestinians said that we will find a mutually accepted formula regarding the right of return, but the truth is that this never happened."

Q: "What do you mean by that?"
A: "They never tried to reach a mutually accepted formula. Everything they said was just a part of the phased plan. I was one of those who opened the American doors for the PLO. When we organized an Israeli-Palestinian conference in Washington in 1987, the State Department refused to give them entry visas. We took it upon ourselves [to take care of all the necessary details] so that they could get the visas. And then they entered the U.S. and took it by storm with our assistance. This is what they wanted, that was the target, to capture the good will of the American Jewish Left. I personally invited them to social gatherings at the homes of Jewish Americans. Their success was owed to our help. Without out our assistance they would never succeed."

Q: "Was that a mistake?"
A: "Not only that this was a mistake, but merely two or three years following [our meetings with the Palestinians in the U.S.] Nabil Sha'ath appeared in front of an audience in Gaza and told them that [their meetings with us] were just a tactical move. [Sha'ath explained to his audience in Gaza that] the Palestinian plan is to make piecemeal gains for the ultimate goal of conquering the entire State of Israel. It became clear to me that the speeches made by Nabil Sha'ath - the same person who was my best friend in America and who came to hug me and kiss me following my pro-peace speeches - were worthless. He did not mean anything he said."

Q: "Does this lack of trust represent a shift for a man of the Left such as yourself?"
A: "There is one thing that no one will ever be able to take away from me, and that is my [commitment to the] truth. It enrages me when I see my friends from the [Labor] party, including the young generation, going to Gaza to greet Yasser Arafat. After all, he is an arch-liar, an arch-murderer. All along I argued that one makes peace with the enemy, but this is conditioned upon the enemy's willingness to make peace as well. If they continue their enemy-type nature, including their murderous acts, than I am not going [to approach them] as a friend. I do not think that Yossi Sarid, Yossi Beilin, Abshalom Vilan, and Anat Ma'or have business in having any contacts [now] with Yasser Arafat. If anyone ought to do it at all, it should only be the government."

Q: "When you said 'they deceived me,' did you refer to all of them?"
A: "I referred to an entire group of people, who do not care about anyone or anything, who deceived me. The fact that Nabil Sha'ath is an opportunist is clear to me. The fact that Ziad Abu-Ziyad is an opportunist is also clear to me. [The answer to the question] whether Hanna Seniora is also one? It is not clear to me. [The answer to the question] whether these professors I met in the U.S. are the same? That I don't know. I don't know if they disagree with Yasser Arafat; I do know I have never heard them [say it]."

Q: "The Israeli Right is blaming the Left for misleading the nation, for orchestrating some kind of a messianic peace movement. Do you accept the charges?"
A: "To a certain degree, yes. We wished for peace so much that we ended up turning our wishes into factual reality. However, there is not going to be peace, not next year and not five years from now. I am not abandoning the path of peace. However, I also refuse to abandon my people and my right to live. However, with the same fervor which I use to speak against the Palestinians I also speak against them."

Q: "Against whom? The Israeli Right?"
A: "Against the settlements which will cause our downfall. Why in the world do they [i.e., the Israeli government] impose on [the Palestinians] the settlement of Ariel in the middle of their territories? Would we accept it if they had built their own Ariel where Netanya is? First, I must be true to myself; I must make sure that my conscience is clear. I am going to take what I deserve even if they do not want to give it to me. But I do not want to take more than what I deserve. [At the same time,] it is very painful to me when they hurt the settlers..."