Report from Save Tara Campaign meeting - Sun 10 Dec

by hmmm Mon Dec 11, 2006 15:04

the digs have begun.
also who chairs?

Because one campaign has spectacularly failed to put Tara in any context
either political or ecological specifically because of the divide and conquer
politics of the leader of that specific campaign.

yes there are diggers- so maybe activites will include apologising to the
people who have been offended and divided by salafia?

by Secretary Mon Dec 11, 2006 15:14

Hi hmmm. The secretary is a Miss. Yes, there is a crisis, and that is why most everyone involved (including your favorite person) are pulling together and making things happen. The time for blameshifting is over. The time for unity is here. I hope you come and join us next Sunday. If not, you have nobody to blame for the ultimate outcome, if it be negative, except yourself.

by Equally frustrated Mon Dec 11, 2006 18:44

Hear hear to you hmm and you poor secretary, people will never learn. More demonstrations - pointless and useless. That seems to be the total outcome of this so-called unity meeting. It would be useful to know WHO exactly was there rather than the organisations that tells the public nothing. I do not see any proposal here that will convince the public in Meath, no political campaign to be waged, nothing to engage the public, nothing that says that the campaign is anti-motorway or simply want it moved.
Who are these faceless people again?
The diggers are moving in both at Clonee and at Skryne, woods are being cleared for preparatory work for the road. Who is doing what about that?
Surely any grouping with certain old faces involved will be doomed to failure?
These new people have no idea ... what a shambles ... and they continue to follow the divide and conquer method.
Shut up shop and go home Tara campaigners. Politicians will not listen to you if your grouping includes this person. The campaign is now officially dead and buried.

by hmmmm Mon Dec 11, 2006 20:27

the salafia campaign failed to create a politcal context, to make use of the talented people
who wanted to save Tara- what it did was suppress anything that did not fit into
one mere person's idea of how a campaign should be won or run.

it is too late for the people who want to help.

so again- there are many roads to Tara to protest, and everyone must do what they
can ,there will be no co-ordination or allowance made for someone in the
crunch situation of the destruction of Tara, who by past bad behaviour
has let down many, and many will not work with him. He knows it.

there have been many ecological struggles in ireland, this has set neither
legal nor moral precedent.

failure= lack of context.
to suceed the campaigns need to stop the co-option, co-ordination and welcome
the many voices under many banners. how, pray does one do that when half of the
eco networks in ireland will not stand in a room with salafia?

by Anja Mon Dec 11, 2006 21:58

Great to see the campaign coming back together. You've all done a great job so far. Don't let them drag you down!

by Observer Mon Dec 11, 2006 22:24

Zapatistas! Cool. That's the kind of energy we need! All campaigns go through their ups and downs, Just look at the Shell situation. Huge division and dissent. Besides, I don't know why you are blaming salafia. He quit the campaign years ago to take his case. Somebody else took over the job of doing publicity for the group, as you can see from other posts to Indymedia. Maybe there is infighting being played out here on Indymedia? Maybe its the NRA. But what is happening now seems to be positive and a lot bigger than any one individual anyway. It looks like all the Tara groups are uniting. Obviously certain people don't want to see that happen. That seems to be the nature of Indymedia. Some people try to do stuff and others try to tear it apart. It happens in all campaigns, but at least the tara folks are trying to deal with it in a dignified and open way. Keep the heads up lads!

by Secretary Tue Dec 12, 2006 14:43

That statment by Equally Frustrated above is completely false. Take a look at the Climate Change Conference being organised by TaraWatch, http://tarawatch.org/

Vincent and the rest of the group managed to get Labour, Fine Gael, the Greens, PDs,Sinn Fein and independent candidates all to participate. Getting all of them into the same room has never been done in this campaign, or any other I know of. And it is presenting a whole new take on the issue, instead of the same old arguments that everyone has heard.

If you have really given up, and think its over, then let the rest of us get on with it. If you want to help, come and participate next Sunday.

There is no chairperson. All positions will be on a rotating basis. It really was a positive and powerful meeting. This is not about individuals, it is about people working together in a unified manner with a logical and coherent process, in a positive way. Then anything is truly possible.

We need help to put the conference on and that is one of the things we are going to talk about...not just demonstrations, which, like it or not, are an essential part of every campaign, regardless of their potential to actually change anything on their own.

by Equally frustrated Tue Dec 12, 2006 16:14

They're not in the same room yet and my friends in Meath tell me that not one of the original campaigners were present at that meeting. They have asked at least 15 people and not one of them was there. Again I ask why not? Why are all those involved with Vincent Salafia now blow-ins to this long campaign?
I wish you luck, get on with it then but remember where you heard the warning and ignore at your peril at every level. Talk to those who were involved, listen to their warning voices before its too late for Tara and yourselves. Mine is not a lone voice much as you might like to think that

by Observer turned activist Tue Dec 12, 2006 20:48

According to my sources in Meath the statement issued after the meeing was agreed by all currently active campaign groups.

As for entering the room, you're mixing up locals and politicians. If a handful of people think they can continue to stymie the campaign by sitting at home they are wrong, and clearly the politicians agree. They are still very much interested in this campign. In fact, I think you're mixed up about a lot of things. A blow-in is somebody from outside Meath I take it. Doesn't that make you one? Or is it someone outside the original group formed in 2003? I take it you are one of those people too.

If you put as much energy into saving Tara as you do attacking campaigners things would probably be much better. Vincent was nominated and elected as PRO at the public meeting in Dalgan Park in 2003, with hundreds of local Meath people present. He stepped down as PRO in March 2005 to take his case. That was just after the big march through Dublin and the visit by the Environment Committee to the hill, and after the issue had been allover the news. Someone else took over as PRO, and since then the issue completely died. The group then into spiral, with member after member quitting, and finally she herself quit, despite postings here that indicate otherwise to the uninformed. These are the facts that are in the public record.

I wonder why you never say a word about Dick Roche, Bertie, Cullen, the NRA and all the other people who are actually the culprits here? I wonder why you have a pathological vendetta against a person who has done so much work for the campaign over the years? I wonder why you won't reveal your identity, and yet seem to talk to and know so many campaigners? I for one hope you don't go near the meeting. After lurking on mailing lists for a long time now, due to other committments, I am going to go, and I am going to bring as many people as I can because I am sick of seeing good people attacked by cowards like you.

The reality is that the Vigil, Save Tara Valley group (the local group) and TaraWatch are working together, and it is a positive thing. There is a new way of working together that just might work, given a chance. You seem to be the main negative force within this campaign and on Indymedia, constantly stirring division, not just with Salafia, but with many members of the public. But you are clearly in the minority.

My friends in Meath already told me that there has been a decision that none of the campaigners will engage you or participate in any discussion here on Indymedia, because they are all convinced you are a plant. And they certainly don't take anything you say seriously. The seriously scary part of tall his though is that you are a person very close to this campaign, whose real identity is unknown to most if not all members. In other words, you are the spy/agitator in their midst. So it is the public and Indymedia who lose because there will never be any productive discussion here as long as you are given a platform.

All Opposition parties and the PDs have agreed to participate in the Climate Change Conference, which uses Meath/M3 as a case study. I take it you are going to spend your time trying to prevent that from happening. You will not succeed, I am happy to say. I won't be responding to any more of our posts either by the way, and I would ask others to do the same. It is time for positive thinking and action, which hopefully have the effect of isolating the traitor in the camp.

by Equally frustrated Wed Dec 13, 2006 00:22

Dear Observer,
Good, I'm glad that you have decided to become involved. Mind you, it would appear from all you say that you have been closer to the campaign than you are prepared to admit yourself.
You certainly know more about the details of the divisions than I do from your analysis of events. No I've never been part ot the campaign, I'm not close to the campaign but I am from Meath and although I no longer live there, my family are still there as I have explained on previous occasions. I have also explained why I have not and cannot be active or why I cannot reveal my identity. This is not yet a dictatorship and I'm under no obligation to reveal who I am than are you or anyone else here.
As your friends in Meath have no idea who I am they cannot decide not to engage with me and one thing sure, I'm no plant - I would wonder at others however.
I'm a little surprised and more than a little shocked that the honest comments of one individual can cause so much upset to people here. Why are people so sensitive? Why is no criticism allowed? Why should I be seen as a spy (hilarious thought) simply because I state the truth as i see it? But if you and others want to see me as an agitator well then, that's you unfortunate choice. If I am a minority then I don't matter. Mind you, the whole campaign is a minority - does that make them irrelevant as well?
I have no intention of spending one second of my precious time in convincing politicans to do anything - I'm a nobody who has no influence with such people, I don't know any of them personally.
As for being a traitor, I suppose I could be angry at the accusation, but its not worth it and long last your innocence and others.
But it will not save Tara and that is what all this is about - is it not?

by TaraWatch Wed Dec 13, 2006 18:59

Nollaig Shona / Happy Holidays from all at TaraWatch - don't forget to support the folks at the Hill http://www.tarasolidarityvigil.net during these dark winter times. See you at Newgrange on the morning of the 21st Dec, for Solstice demonstration