European Social Forum inaccessible

by Movement of Imagination - Globalise Resistance Fri Jul 19, 2002 13:29

The ESF is going to bring together a lot of serious forces from around Europe who have done some big things, things we have not yet fone in Ireland in our wildest dreams. Spain had a general strike, and 500,000 at the Barcelona EU summit demos. Italy has had a general strike of 13 million and the movement has grown after Genoa. 1.3 million people demonstrated against fascism in France on Mayday, 3 million voting for declared revolutionary candidates.

Personally, if these people are organising a get together in Firenze, I'm going. Of course people like Pilger, Chomsky, Agnoletto, Bove and all will be speaking- a lot of people will come to here them. But it would be a mistake to see this as the purpose of the ESF- a cariacture of the star system in pop or film.

I think Florence will be invaluable because of the real links and networks that will be made between grassroots activists. European wide co ordinations, demonstrations and strikes happening in all major cities at the same time- against war, for Palestine, asylum rights, against privatisation. That's the future.

Also the ESF will have a major fringe festival element to it. If you don't want to go to a session, DIY. Every group will be holding their own meetings on what they like- and as there'll be thousands of people at the ESF, it's a good way of spreading your message and meeting similar groups from across Europe.

The PGA event in the Netherlands is a good idea, but I don't think it has been built for in any major way here in Ireland. A few of the usual activists might go, but I expect it will be tiny by comparison.

After Genoa, this is what the Italians have decided to do, and we Irish can learn a lot from the Italian movement. I think it's good they've called a summit of the movement to discuss the way forward on a European wide level.

by chekov Fri Jul 19, 2002 16:49

Or maybe a summit of whichever parts of the movement Refundazione Communista want to allow to speak. It seems that the organisers are not really interested in engaging in debate and free exchange of ideas, rather they see the attendees as passive consumers of star-driven speeches telling us once again how bad capitalism is. The speakers, subject matters and ground rules are decided in advance by a cabal of Leninist parties, especially RC. The punters are sheep to be herded into the 'sphere of influence' of the Leninists, in their cuddly guise of NGO-loving reformists, and certainly not to be allowed to contribute to anything that might remotely resemble a debate.

How long before we hear that "the European Social Forum IS the European anti-capitalist movement. The various petit bourgeois anarchists, environmentalists and uncontrollables are not a part of this movement and never have been, this is a movement grounded in the working class and has no place for these petit bourgeois idealists and police agents..."

by jerkoff Fri Jul 19, 2002 22:36

like the original poster says the whole thing is a load of bollox, organized by a bunch of psuedo lefties, the left is a bourgeois dream that has
belly flopped, but the middle class radical chic still clinging on.
left and right are just bullshit distractions to divide the working class. don't think that refondazione communista are any better. they are not getting a slice of the action cos they are to far down the pecking order.they don''t count for shit. But when it comes to the crunch the party comes before ordinary people.
party time is over time to try and get along with out them. the province of firenze and the region of tuscany is controlled by a totalitarian regime which is propped up by freemasonary and the oldest bank in the world, the bank of masons and parasites of Siena, rip off artists since 1472 . from time !!
check it any one from the area will confirm ::

by esf Mon Jul 22, 2002 10:44

Oh dear, how sad, the brave "vanguard" of the anarchist movement in Ireland are so concerned with being sullied by being at the same place as reformists and lenninsts that they aren't going to the ESF.

Now that is a real pity, since their contribution to the movement in Ireland has been so useful.
It is a shame that they won't bring their useful, inciteful experience of building a open mass movement in Ireland to those misguided Italians.

by chekov Mon Jul 22, 2002 15:58

What is the point in going to a meeting where it has been decided in advance that your point of view is going to be excluded? This is the problem, not any fears about being sullied by reformists. The WSM took a full and active part in the ANV in Ireland during the abortion referendum alongside all sorts of reformists and authoritarians. Meanwhile some of the Trots involved misbehaved in their normal fashion and attempted to split the movement and appeared only interested in recuperating what they could from it. Calling for unity, when all the important decisions have already been made by a clique of Leninists, is hypocritical in the extreme.

Unity (as long as it's under our leadership)!
Open debate (as long as we decide the speakers)!
Diversity (except anarchists, ecologists....)!

Why not attempt to respond to some of the criticisms rather than snidely attacking those who criticise?

by cynic Mon Jul 22, 2002 18:49

along with your Maoist friends from the MST

by Andrew Tue Jul 23, 2002 14:18

Some serious criticisms have been made of the way the ESF is being organised. Any chance that some of those promoting it will answer these?

by Brian Cahill Tue Jul 23, 2002 19:22

The organisation of the European Social Forum is both secretive and highly undemocratic. In all likelihood the official sessions will be every bit as stage managed as those at the World Social Forum.

Nothing too radical, nothing which might scare NGO career bureaucrats will be mentioned.

Still though, the ESF will provide an opportunity to meet activists from all around Europe and some of the unofficial meetings will be interesting.