10 Irish Citizens Under Fire in Bilin in the West Bank

by Weary Sat Mar 01, 2008 09:31

You people do know there is a war on?

A crowd carrying a mock coffin and trying to breach a wire barrier would look suspiciously like a cover for a terrorist attack to soldiers indoctrinated that they are in a fight to the death for the survival of the Jewish people armed to the teeth and manning a border in the middle of a violent warzone.

Personally I hope the there is a Palestinian State and an Israeli State side by side in peace and all the issues are sorted out - economic, land, settlements, the right to return, holy sites, religious extremism on both sides, security for both Jews and Palestinians etc etc.

But protests like these are the height of stupidity - they insure that soldiers will shoot, that civilians will die, that both sides will blame each other and conflict will continue.

by Kev - various Sat Mar 01, 2008 16:37

There is a weekly peaceful protest at Bilin every Friday and has been for the past three years. The idea that a symbolic coffin could be thought to be 'cover for a terrorist attack' is ridiculous. In the past (in fact on regular basis) the IDF have fired on and injured peaceful protesters in Bilin. This is the terrorism of the powerful against the powerless - Palestinians, Israelis and Internationals.

Reports of violent attacks on peaceful protestors at Bilin: http://www.imemc.org/newswire/nonviolentaction/english

The IMEMC report from yesterday's attack: http://www.imemc.org/article/53143

by TD - Ireland-Palestine Solidarity Campaign Sun Mar 02, 2008 08:28

Photos

by CC Sun Mar 02, 2008 20:41

Having recently visiting Palestine I can tell you it is not a fence but a wall The problem with this wall is that it dones not save lives. While I was in Nablus five young boys were murdered by the Israeli Defence force.

Maerton you should open your eyes to see what is happening to the Palestinian people.

by Luimni Mon Mar 03, 2008 10:45

I am humbled by the bravery of the people of Bilin. I was one of the Irish contingent who attended the aforementioned peaceful rally.
Anyone has a right to protest peacefully if they so wish and that is what this protest was about, peace.
The locals sang while a brave soul walked up to a security barrier and displayed the mock coffin and as he was returning back from the barrier with his back turned to the soldiers, it was then the IDF decieded to fire and hit him with a rubber bullit. They fired on him as he was walking away!!!! there was no security risk and no cause for them to open fire. I was shocked by this. Another local protester was hit as we were walking away down the hill, again with his back turned walking back toward the village with us.
How cowardly the IDF were in doing such things compared to the bravery of the peolpe of Bilin and their supporters who will be there next Friday to face the unjust violence of the IDF.
The IDF also began firing from the base of the hill which denied any peaceful protestor passage back to the village. This forced the Irish group to take an alternate route through a nearby field. The IDF persued and continued to fire rubber bullits towards the Irish group who were at least 200 meters away from the main demonstation at the fence.
We were eventually boxed in on three sides, as we initially did not want any confrontation with the IDF our only option would have been to go back up the hill towards the security fence. This was contrary to what the IDF had asked people to do, they had asked people to disperse and leave the area which we were doing.
We casually walked as we were herded back to the main path which was open ground and made us more vunerable to stray rubber bullit fire. Held in open ground for a time and then asked to follow the soldiers where the path split towards a group of young kids who were protesting at the base of the hill.
The IDF were herding us back into another area of possible risk which led me to believe that it for their protection and not to facilitate our exit from the area. We wisely did not follow the soldiers and took the other path directly back to the village.

by Colm de Faoite Tue Mar 04, 2008 10:43

I was not present at the attack on the Irish people at Bilin but I spoke to them a short time afterwards. It was clear to me that what happened was not an indisciplined foray by young soldiers but a coordinated attempt to frighten anybody who dared witness what was happening to Palestinians who exercised their right to protest peacefully against the illegal seizure of their land. Irish citizens could have been killed or maimed and protests should be made to the Israelis even though they will ignore them. Of course this is a minor episode compared to the lindiscriminate slaughter of children and civilian adults in Gaza over the last week. Clearly the Israeli war-lords have declared an open season on Palestinians.

by Tom Tue Mar 04, 2008 16:02

How could joining a protest that is regularly fired at by soldiers and then getting fired at by soldiers be considered steering clear of dangers. If your mind wasnt so completely blurred with Arab hatred, you would see that it is the exact opposite.

by Ronan Tue Mar 04, 2008 16:29

Yeah, Sceptic, people should concentrate on their own problems. Changing their car or redesigning their garden, maybe buying new clothes for a party or something. Ya know, the big stuff. If it doesn’t involve me, then I’m alright.

Very commendable comments from the safety of your desk. If they were to put themselves in “real danger” as you put it, you would still moan.

The funny thing is you don’t practice what you preach, you spend quite some time posting your views and comments on this and maybe other sites. Why do you indulge yourself? Your decision to get involved, in your own way, is second only to your high level of participation, on this site at least.

If such horrific abuse was happening in your town, at your house, to your family, would you welcome somebody come to see what was happening to your family? Would you ask them to tell others outside your country what was happening to the people you care about?
Or would you view them as interfering busybodies and tell them feck off?

by Mr. Man Tue Mar 04, 2008 23:40

Pretty scary to be there i'm sure. Israel is pretty scared about an incident happening at the border like what happened into Egypt. Still, pretty cold-hearted to hit a guy in the back.

by Rónan Wed Mar 05, 2008 09:33

I was one of those who took part in the march.

I find the comments by those such as Sceptic and Weary merely cynical ramblings of those who don't care. I'm neither a republican nor a human rights activist, just an ordinary person. I was curious about the situation in Israel & Palestine, and instead of planting my arse on the couch or a bar stool and ranting, decided to go and see for myself. While there we met with a range of groups from both Zionist Israeli settlers through human rights groups (Israeli, Palestinian and international) to "ordinary" Palestinians & Israelis.

Those of us who were there at the march, only found out about it on the Thursday, and it was our sense of outrage at the Israeli state policies creating sectarian near apartheid conditions for Palestinians that motivated us to march. There is nothing as galvanising as observing outright injustice.

In the case of the march, it was traumatic for us to say the least, but no, its true we're not Palestinians who have to live under these conditions every day.

There is clear oppression as part of israeli state policy at work here and yes, now, I would call myself an activist.

Get off the couch

by Ronan Wed Mar 12, 2008 11:55

Hi Rónan,

There is a protest tomorrow (Thursday 13th) at the EU offices in Molesworth Street, parallel to middle of Grafton St. from 1-2pm.

Come along for an hour if you can... Cheers.

Check out www.ipsc.ie for more information.

Cheers,
Ronan

by Sceptic Wed Mar 12, 2008 17:27

The EU offices again - I suspect it is that they are very visible and centrally located- much easier to picket then the Iranian embassy though they are the real culprits in the whole Gaza saga. The EU has actually been a very good friend of the Palestinians fro decades – it is the wrong target for demos of this kind.

It’s not so much that the EU acts as a proxy for Israel as alleged on the IPSC website. A familiarity with the situation would determine that such sensitive frontier matters have to be managed on a multilateral basis if the EU is going to be involved as it can only be involved by the agreement of all parties including the neighbours of the Gaza Strip.

The real problem is that Hamas is a proxy for Tehran as also is Hezbollah in Lebanon. Tehran seeks an extension of its influence in the region and to that end needs to keep the pot of violence and instability well stirred. The worst thing that could happen for Tehran's ambitions would be a peace agreement between the PA and Israel - therefore it will seek to prevent this at any cost in Palestinian let alone Israeli lives.

by Ronan Wed Mar 12, 2008 23:32

You say the that the EU is a friend to Palestine. If your friends treat you like the European Union treats the Palestinian people, it’s no wonder you’re sceptical.

I’m an EU citizen and don’t agree with much of what the EU has done in this whole situation. So I’m not going to be as silent as the EU in this regard.

by Sceptic Thu Mar 13, 2008 14:31

The various EU bodies and representatives are anything but silent the Palestinian question. Solana made a statement just the other day after his trip to the region and this was just the latest in a long series. I say it again - the EU is the wrong target for demos on this issue. Right now its doing more than any other quartet party and in a quite disinterested manner.

by G.D.Flynn - International Republican Thu Mar 13, 2008 14:52 flynnfacultasliterum at hotmail dot com

Sceptic and his professional Cabal of Media bloggers,who never makes a mistake,spelling or otherwise,his facts and numbers are always correct according to the official jewish line,the first to complain,the first to erase any dissent,the first to oppose the Republic,the first to forward Islamaphobia,he or they first to live in the Republic Of Eire.
Just Who are you Sceptic ? and what Cabalistic Group do you Represent
is this a full time stint ? or do you take shifts ?
If you wonder why no one trusts your Logic,its because its bigoted,and comes straight out of Tel Aviv !

by Sceptic Thu Mar 13, 2008 19:24

You should argue on the facts not on creating fallacies about identities. In any case I am an ordinary Joe from Dublin with no connection whatever to Israel or any cabal. I have to speak out when I see this form of lazy protesting from people who could not be bothered to discover what the actual record of the EU is in regard to Palestinian issues. In fact it is long, distinctive and rich. In your uncritical regard for Hamas and your critical stance towards the EU you have things precisely the wrong way around. My impression is of people who protest first and enquire later if at all and I am sure the fact that the EU offices are so central is why it is done so often – its no sacrifice of anybody’s time or effort to picket a few yards from Grafton Street at 1pm on a week day. The default drive picket for those who derive satisfaction from such things. But these people lack the intellectual capacity or the application or both to really find out about the EU and its very extensive involvement in Palestinian issues over very many years.

by Ronan Fri Mar 14, 2008 12:14

You have it arseways as usual Ordinary Joe.
If you disagree with Hamas actions and if want to picket any Hamas office or the Iranian embassy, fire away. If the IPSC or any other person disagrees with the actions of the EU, then they are entitled to picket it. Also criticism of EU does not automatically preclude criticism of Hamas, you just wish to turn every call for human rights in Palestine into a support for Hamas. That is not the case. I don't support Hamas at all and the focus of any EU protest is to highlight EU action or inaction.

You hold up the EU as a friend of Palestine. The claim that “it’s doing more than any other quartet party” is pretty meaningless. The Quartet mouths empty platitudes toward helping Palestine The US is actively engaged in supporting Israel in every possible manner, which has only increased with the Bush administration. The UN is hamstrung by the US. Russia is not much better and seems to be concerned with consolidation of power at home. This leaves the ‘friendly’ EU, whose continual, unquestioning backing of the corrupt PA contributed to the rise of Hamas and the deterioration of the situation for ordinary Palestinian families across the West Bank and Gaza. It has effective neutralised any power that the democratic vote among the people might have in Palestine as the outside world won’t recognise their vote in certain areas. The EU blockade of aid in 2007 contributed to the deaths and dire economic and social situations so prevalent in Palestine. For time to time the EU may release a statement, complaining about some major atrocity committed by Israel/Zionists/US. The silence of the EU on the day to day systematic destruction of Palestine and the lack of any meaningful and potent action to call Israel to task should not go unheeded.

The fact that the trade between the EU and Israel has increased steadily and systemically over the recent years highlights the unbalanced nature of this ‘friendship’.

Report on a Trade agreement (1995)
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Economy/eut....html

“Israeli Acting Prime Minister and Foreign Minister Shimon Peres, a new trade treaty between Israel and the European Union was signed. The agreement replaces the 1975 agreement, and includes a number of new components, which will strengthen ties between Israel and the European Union. The treaty's purpose, as defined in its text, is to provide a framework for political dialogue, and to strengthen economic relations between the EU and Israel”

The EU- Israel Association agreement (2007) seeks to further enhance these trade (and other) agreements. These may pay lip service to some Palestinian issues or the tacit (or even explicit) underlying ideology maybe it will bring Israel closer in order to promote stability in the Middle East. The repeated actions of the Israelis should be a cause for concern as they repeatedly take what they need out of many political/economic situations similar to this, and then pursue their own agenda when it suits them. Do you think that they are afraid to act unilaterally when they want? All the increase in trade does is legitimise Israeli/Zionist actions and human rights abuses http://www.amnestyusa.org/document.php?lang=e&id=ENGIOR...72006

It actually strengthens the state of Israel, which then bring their considerable power to destroy Palestinian society. How is that the action of a friend?

The hypocrisy of a desk-based moaner complaining about the location choice for a protest by street-based activists is not lost on people reading your posts.

by Sceptic Fri Mar 14, 2008 22:04

“The fact that the trade between the EU and Israel has increased steadily and systemically over the recent years highlights the unbalanced nature of this ‘friendship’.”

It does not in the sense you mean. Trade does not mean that the institutions are not even handed or cannot have good relations with each side or that the EU cannot aid the PA and other recipients. The fact of trade between European countries and Israel has nothing to do with this. There is no restriction or boycott on such trade. Why should it reflect poorly on the institutions of the EU community if such trade takes place just because you might dislike it? A decision on a trade boycott would be a matter for the Governments in the Council of Ministers – not the Commission. Your quarrel is really with each Government of the Union not the union itself as well as almost every Government outside the union except for those in the Muslim world which don’t trade with Israel. Russia and China trade with Israel – why don’t you protest outside those embassies? Kenya has not been overly vocal in condemning Israeli atrocities – why not picket its diplomatic mission? You could just as easily argue that almost any country “could be doing more” by your lights and mount a demo against it. Question: Which countries do you consider are “doing enough” in this situation? Iran, Syria?

The EU is a facilitator in the region – it can only work with parties which observe basic diplomatic realities like the PA authority in the West Bank but Hamas is a horse of a different colour. The would be mediator in the Gaza-Israel conflict cannot be blamed if one or more of the parties is continually initiating hostilities like the rocket and mortar attacks into Israel despite the withdrawal of all Israeli forces form the strip and the settlements. The same is true to a lesser extent of other quartet parties.

Essentially the EU is not as anti Israeli as you would like. However there are no objective grounds for this agitation against which is often based on an ignoring of the facts of full engagement with the region and the issues but within the constraints of realities like the existence of Israel and the fact that Gaza is not all or even most of the PA area and the Hamas is behaving aggressively in the matter of rocket and mortar attacks.