John Pilger : 80 per cent of the media echoed US/UK government lies on the invasion of Iraq

by Fred Johnston Sun Dec 17, 2006 17:10 sylfredcar at iolfree dot ie

Yesterday the Irish Times (Dec 16th) revealed that the US Military now have a 'full-time' Army officer stationed at Shannon acting as 'liaison' with the rest of the country. A FULL-TIME US military post at Shannon! Read that any way you will, Irish neutrality is sold once and for all. Interestingly, the article adds that Irish Times journalists were allowed to board the US military aircraft - but clearly this is a problem for the gardaí, whom Bertie Ahern will not permit inside the 'planes.
As for the 'civil war' in Palestine; yes of course there's a US dirty war group somewhere working this out with Israel, you'd be daft to think there isn't. Democracy was disgraced by the refusal of US satraps like ourselves and others in Europe to recognise the legitimately elected party of Hamas in government, merely because the Israelis said they weren't having it.
But then again, since when was Ireland a democracy? Big business runs Fianna Fáil. Two US ambassadors roam the country warning us not to shout too loudly about Shannon or jobs will be lost, and we say nothing. The church rules here still, as was amply demonstrated by the rattle of croziers in Bertie Ahern's face during the week, and, like a whipped schoolboy, he retreated to his corner, embarrassed, no doubt, that more foreward-looking minds in his own party had put him in such a situation.
On a wider stage, Blair is an ailing US puppet, Condie Rice works on batteries and is operated by remote-control, and Bush is merely insane. Happy days, compadres!

by Aidan Mon Dec 11, 2006 18:11

John Pilger is a rare voice of reason in times of war frenzy and media irrationality. His recent book is well worth reading: Freedom Next Time

However, seeing as we are on the topic of lies, truth, politics and the war in Iraq: the Downing Street Documents are well worth examining

http://www.downingstreetmemo.com/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Downing_street_memo

by Tim Hourigan Sun Dec 10, 2006 01:34

Lies by Righteous Pragmatist Sat Dec 09, 2006 07:47
Prior to the invasion of Iraq the entire United Nations Security council believed that Iraq had WMD.
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No they didn't. Not even the Irish with their temporary seat believed it. A full SIX MONTHS before the invasion of Iraq, the Irish Dept of Foreign Affairs, which received a copy of the dodgy dossier, told the Govt, that their experts said the report was not credible. The information was 'stovepiped'. Just like an RP argument, it was full of spin, and with a pre-determined result.

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For more than a decade the UN passed resolution after resolution which were ignored by Saddam Hussein as he refused to allow UN inspectors to investigate his WMD programs.
Because Saddam refused access it was presumed with some justification based on his record of using chemical weapons during the Iran/Iraq war made possible by technology provided by Western countries during the 1980's, the testimony of dissidents from his regime and the tantilisingly brief encounter western intelligence agencies had with Saddam's two son-in-laws who fled to Jordon before foolishly returning and being murdered, that he still possessed WMD and still despite his crushing defeat in Kuwait, and planned on threatening the region again.
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To hear UN Weapons inspector, and retired US Marine Major Scott Ritter tell it, the inspections established the destruction of the WMD programs and disabling of his facilities, and the US Govt DID try to put CIA spies in with the UN inspections teams, and Saddam - evil, arrogant, fairly stupid, but not insane - didn't want to let them in to his palaces.

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Nothing was done during the 1990's because Saddam was effectively boxed in by UN sanctions which crippled the Iraqi economy and conventional military. Western governments gambled the Saddam's Iraq would become an irrelevance like Fidel Castro's Cuba.

Then 9/11 occurred and apart from Mullah Omar, Saddam Hussein was the sole world leader who praised the attacks.

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So what if he praised them? That's pretty minor on the list of things that made him an @sshole. Supporting Saddam militarily, financially and politically when he DID have and used WMD against his own people and against Iran is a crime, and that was good grounds to get rid of him in the 1980s!!. whereas being an @sshole and praising the murder of thousands is not actually a crime - otherwise Madeline Albright would go to jail for saying 'it was worth it' to execute the sanctions that killed so many Iraqi kids.

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Now it was conceivable for a rogue dictator to supply WMD to terrorists.

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Conceivable is the same as not probable. And Saddam was not a rogue dictator. He was an evil scumbag dictator, but he was boxed in and not causing much hassle on the international scene.
And let me quote Colin Powell on that one - Feb24, 2001 press conference in Cairo.
"He has not developed any significant capability with respect to weapons of mass destruction. He is unable to project conventional power against his neighbors. "

Remember that RP?
In case you don't, here's the footage...
http://www.thememoryhole.org/war/powell-rice-wmd.wmv

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Saddam may or may not have made moves to do so but America decided to remove him from power rather than take the chance.

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Sure, that was the motivation. The timing would suggest otherwise. Saddam hadn't done jack $h!t in ages, and there were other countries proliferating nuclear technology (the Pakistani guy for example) and no shortage of dictators that could have been targeted. The one with the oil and borders with Iran, Syria and Saudi Arabia got picked because of ????

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It turns out that Saddam has got rid of his WMD years before.

But now we know.

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And THEY knew beforehand.... stop apologising for their deliberate mass murder. It makes you look foolish (again)

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Saddam had a WMD infrastructure ready operate as soon as UN sanctions were lifted.

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No he didn't. The UN Weapons Inspectors had done a good job in locating and verifying the state of Iraqi WMD. I suppose being able to check the invoices from the Western countries that sold him the weapons provided them with a list to tick off eh?

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by righteous pragmatist Sat Dec 09, 2006 14:54
A comprehensive survey was conducted by Charles Duelfer and the Iraq Survey Group and they did not discover the presence of WMD stockpiles.
They did however discover an enormous infrastructure of dual use technology and facilities and an enormous number of documents which have since been declassified and are freely available on the web that detailed Iraqi plans to recommence the production of WMD once the UN sanctions were lifted.

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Plans? Why don't you link to these plans that are freely available on the web? Plans are not the same as WMD factories and infrastructure, you can't kill someone with a plan.

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It has also been proven beyond much doubt that Saddam had indeed sought to purchase supertitiously uranium yellowcake from African countries.

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The Niger forgeries? did you sleep through that one... "proven beyond much doubt"... more like laughed out of the park.

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The 9/11 commission investigated the activities of Al-Qaeda and if you would bother to read it presents strong evidence of Iraqi involvement with Al-Qaeda and other terrorist groups including Al-Zaraqawi prior to 9/11.

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The 9/11 commission? You're kidding me. Actually somebody asked Bush straight up what Iraq had to do with 9/11, and he said "Nothing". I kid you not. Here's the clip on YouTube...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6BxOfmH9wlA

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For many years it has been known that Iraqi agents met with Muhammed Atta in Hamburg prior to the 9/11 attacks.

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No, it was reported, and then quietly acknowledged to be untrue. Try again.

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The level of Al-Qaeda activity with the co-operation of former Baathists since 2003 demonstrates that the insurgency and campaign of violence against US forces and the Iraqi people was planned in advance.

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According the US Generals in Iraq, (and the baker Report) Al Qaeda represents the smallest faction of the insurgency. But then again an armchair general like yourself outranks those guys right? The idea that the Iraqis are doing their own fighting and dying because they don't want to be occupied by a country that inflicted killer santions, and DU on them is beyond your grasp is it?

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Publicly available evidence is also free on the web if you would care to look.
The evidence of Saddam's collusion with terrorism and his quest to develop and use WMD is overwhelming.

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I would like to look, could you provide a link?
Lots of nutters would like WMD. Saddam had them at one point, used them several times on innocent people. The US and Britain left him alone. All your arguments are easily debunked. It is clear to anyone who bothers to question facts WHY Iraq was invaded and occupied. The official reasons are just a smokescreen, with some followers, because of course Saddam's such an evil pr1ck with a long list of crimes... making up new crimes is a shoddy attempt to cover up the fact that he was supported by Western Governments for so long during his real crimes. May I also point out that Saddam is currently alive and in good health, while 655,000 Iraqis died since the invasion, and over half a million kids died during the sanctions... and yet there was frequent reference to a "War on Saddam" and emphasis that it was "not on the Iraqi people"... Wow, I'm pretty sure if the US made war against me, I'd be dead a lot quicker than a million of my neighbours... but that's just me and my logic, I keep forgetting that so many warmongers ignore logic, along with morality, laws, the truth, etc.

by ostrich Sat Dec 09, 2006 10:27

"Prior to the invasion of Iraq the entire United Nations Security council believed that Iraq had WMD." Are you dreaming the Bush denialist dream, RP?

I think u'd better ask Hans Blix and Richard the aussie forget his last name and numerous other weapons inspectors who the Americans undermined. The PRE-PLANNED invasion must not be interfered with at any cost -- well today we see the results of the lies and the machinations of criminals in high places -- TAKE A GOOD LOOK AT IRAQ and weep you fuckin' moron, have you ever seen innocent kids die?

What you are RP, is either a psy-op or moron or both! The final word on WMD from the experts was they were unable to detect the presence of any WMD, hence the ice-cream truck (mobile 'LSD' labs) performance from Colin Powell -- but you and I both know that WMD exist [in the dreams of idiots and the plan of PNAC signatories].

It really would be better for your reputation if your were in the employ of the conservatives, otherwise you might have to wear the title of cretin.

by Righteous Pragmatist Sat Dec 09, 2006 08:47

Prior to the invasion of Iraq the entire United Nations Security council believed that Iraq had WMD. For more than a decade the UN passed resolution after resolution which were ignored by Saddam Hussein as he refused to allow UN inspectors to investigate his WMD programs.Because Saddam refused access it was presumed with some justification based on his record of using chemical weapons during the Iran/Iraq war made possible by technology provided by Western countries during the 1980's, the testimony of dissidents from his regime and the tantilisingly brief encounter western intelligence agencies had with Saddam's two son-in-laws who fled to Jordon before foolishly returning and being murdered, that he still possessed WMD and still despite his crushing defeat in Kuwait, and planned on threatening the region again.

Nothing was done during the 1990's because Saddam was effectively boxed in by UN sanctions which crippled the Iraqi economy and conventional military. Western governments gambled the Saddam's Iraq would become an irrelevance like Fidel Castro's Cuba.

Then 9/11 occurred and apart from Mullah Omar, Saddam Hussein was the sole world leader who praised the attacks.

Now it was conceivable for a rogue dictator to supply WMD to terrorists.

Saddam may or may not have made moves to do so but America decided to remove him from power rather than take the chance.

It turns out that Saddam has got rid of his WMD years before.

But now we know.